January Sales

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Comments

  • 1 in for me
    Short term defensive cover
  • IronHerb said:

    Prob

    Given how out of form Coufal/Johnson (and Kehrer) have been I'll be very disappointed letting Ashby go

    Understand from his perspective, if he can't get in the squad even if the ones infront of him are bang out of form he's not gonna get a chance, at 21 he needs to take the wheel of his own career

    Coufal has been back in form for the last two games.
    Not sure "for the last two games" justifies that he hasn't had a look in for 18 months where the RBs have struggled
  • He played with a groin injury for half a season.
  • IronHerb said:

    He played with a groin injury for half a season.

    And Ashby didn't get a look in....even more proving the point of why he's leaving
  • If he's not going to fight for the shirt them maybe he's not worth keeping.
  • edited January 2023
    IronHerb said:

    If he's not going to fight for the shirt them maybe he's not worth keeping.

    The counter argument is what more does he need to do? He's played well for the U23s, pretty sure he's captained the side, and has won international U21 caps. He's seen Coufal injured and struggling for form, he's seen Johnson and Kehrer also fail to nail down the position this season, and still hasn't been given a chance.

    I don't think there's anything there to suggest that he doesn't want to fight for the shirt; arguably he's been doing that for a couple of seasons now with his performances in the U23s without reward.

    Could be that he's just not good enough, but for Newcastle - with their resources - to be interested suggests that he has something about him.
  • It seems strange that we refused to let him go in the summer, and yet he's only featured in one Europa Conference League match so far this season.
  • IronHerb said:

    If he's not going to fight for the shirt them maybe he's not worth keeping.

    What can you do when you are 21, excelling at the u23 and you have a injured/out-of-form right back (right backs as Johnson hasn't been nearly good enough) infront of you and you've been given no opportunities

    Next think he'll know he'll be 22/23 like Coventry still getting farmed out on loan which is absolute waste of time
  • Do we know if he's been training with the first team?
  • I guess if he is insistent he won't sign a new contract then this is all we can do. I just think it's not good from his position. At 21 he does need opportunities to play football and I don't see them any more forthcoming at Newcastle than with us, and quite probably even less so.
  • He's going for the money imo.
  • edited January 2023
    https://www.football.london/west-ham-united-fc/news/moyes-west-ham-transfer-sunderland-26098435

    This appears to be David Moyes views on the topic pre Ashby leaving.
  • IronHerb said:

    He's going for the money imo.

    Yep imo too. I've said this on here before but I work with a friend of his and he said he (Ashby) doesn't even like football. He'll see it as more of a way to earn more money sooner imo.
  • I think it was John Lyall who once said if someone aged 20-21 thereabouts is not already in or pushing hard for a first team place then they’re never likely to be.
  • thorn, Yes that is a fair comment but IF the manager/coaches are reluctant to promote the young players then they are unlikely to get a chance. Arsene Wenger once said a lot of managers don't give youth a chance as they are only driven by results so revert to the tried & trusted even if some of the players are not playing well.
  • Of course managers are driven by results. They get sacked.
    It's not the managers job to create a club policy about youth development. That decision is taken at a higher level. If the board want youth to play in the 1st team then they should tell the manager that and he will implement it.

    Although, I'm not sure any manager would be happy with a board telling him who to select.
  • edited January 2023
    MrsGrey said:

    Although, I'm not sure any manager would be happy with a board telling him who to select.

    I can't see any manager being prepared to work under those conditions tbh.
  • But then you employ a manager who is happy to play the youngsters.
  • IronHerb said:

    But then you employ a manager who is happy to play the youngsters.

    risk being sacked...

    and getting a large pay off ;-)
  • Not if this is understood at the interview, but you would be silly to keep going when it was failing.
  • I think Wenger’s point is they focus on short-term results rather than a long term development. Arteta could have easily been got ridden off at several points over the last couple of years but has really developed Arsenal’s young players. Now they have a good core of players who are likely to develop and they haven’t spent much money on.

    I get the idea of saying they would play if they’re good enough or looking at those who have moved on and saying that if they haven’t done anything they weren’t good enough but I’m not sure it works like that. Playing with better players and against better players probably helps your development quite a lot and there’s probably a big mental aspect to being let go by a club you’ve been with for a lot of your life.

    We see so many players bought and have no impact on the team or maybe a fleeting good stint but I would really enjoy a manager who could do more to incorporate our young players. I’ve always said they don’t have to be superstars, they don’t have to Declan Rices but they can be James Tomkins or Ben Johnson, players who will regularly play and be valuable to the overall squad instead of all these filler players we’ve bought over the years.
  • I think, though (not disagreeing with much of what you've said) that the 'top 6' clubs probably get the pick of the youngsters. So it's not quite a level playing field in terms of youngster development. Plus they are regularly in more comps, and/or go further in competitions. So more opportunities to play, and put out the kids when the first leg (or group stage) is in the bag. kind of thing.
  • So, damned if you do, and damned if you don't.
  • Sorry to see Ashby leave.
    Ngakia was a highly rated at RB but left WHU for Watford and hasn't set the RB position on fire. Nathan Holland was good at U-23 level but didn't make the grade. Of course, all clubs have a history of releasing excellent players young players who later make the grade, but in this result oriented businesses managers have to make a judgement.
  • I'm sure I saw a stat recently that was that fewer that 1% of academy players end up having a professional football career. In any league!

    I'll see if I can find it again...check if I remembered it accurately.

    But if that's the case, then I don't think we can blame Moyes 😂

  • Moyes has confirmed that Zouma has a muscle tear and Cornet is still weeks away from even being close to a first team return.

    Will be interesting to see what happens over the next couple of days. With Ings and Scamacca already injured I think it would be risky not to bring in another forward, and with Zouma out for a while, we could be short at the back.

    There's room in the squad for 2 or 3 more I think, but I'm not convinced we'll use those spaces. Think it'll be a quiet 48 hours.
  • edited January 2023
    Would David Moyes have given Chris Rigg a substitute appearance yesterday if he was still @ Sunderland? For those who don't know he is fifteen years old. Tony Mowbray's side contained seven players aged 22 or younger at kick-off.
  • Would David Moyes have given Chris Rigg a substitute appearance yesterday if he was still @ Sunderland? For those who don't know he is fifteen years old. Tony Mowbray's side contained seven players aged 22 or younger at kick-off.

    This is one of those “ I do not it for a fact, but I know is true” moments , answer - No he wouldn’t,

    And to be fair, Sunderland looked really good for their draw against Fulham and fully played their part to a spirted game.

  • I think Tony Mowbray us known to give youth players a chance.
This discussion has been closed.